I don't know if everyone here knows what they are, but I have a Xanga weblog (aka online journal) that I make regular posts to. I even have my own blogring on Xanga called *~)0(~*Eclectic Pagans*~)0(~* that currently has over sixty people.
Well, upon visiting my blog last night, I noticed a comment left for me by someone who's Xanga ID was proverbs### something or other. This is the comment he left me, and below will be my answers. I just thought I'd share.
His comments:
Ok, your witch. I am a Christian. To make a point very clear, I will never turn away from, or denounce Christ Jesus. I would rather die first and go to the place prepared for me by Him. With that said I would be lying if I didn't say what you practice pricks my curiousity. I have often wondered about different "why's" and "What do witches think about...". So I typed in coven in a blogring search and you are the lucky site. So here we go......
1. What exactly are witches thoughts on Jesus Christ(God the Son), God the Spirit, and God the Father?
2. The Bible says there is magic and witches, so I believe it. However(once again, just wondering) I think that a witch can do nothing to me because of my faith in Jesus Christ. I am in pure confidence that since I depend soley on Jesus as Savior that no curse, spell, or charm, or anything that is invoked or cast can do anything to me because He is guarding me. Comments?
3. The prophecies in the Bible have been fufilled have been historically proven, which to me is proof that God Himself inspired His Holy Word. What do witches think about the Bible?
4. What drew you to witchcraft as oppossed to anything else?
Ok that's all I can think of. These are just questions, and I mean no offense.
~God Bless, Michael Posted 3/1/2005 at 4:49 PM by proverbs163_03
My answers:
#1- Personally, I can’t answer for all witches, pagans, asatru, wiccans, etc. but many pagans (and from here on out I will probably just be using the word pagan) do believe that Jesus did exist, but we don’t believe in him the way that Christians do. My husband and I personally believe he was a radical Rabbi trying to bring the Hebrew faith back from corruption. His teachings are admired, just as those of any great spiritual leader. He said he was a son of God, but not the only son (or daughter) of “God”. We are all children of “God”. As you have your trinity, many pagans believe in the threefold goddess and god. The Goddess is viewed as the Maiden, Mother, and Crone. The God is the Son, the Consort, and Lord of Death. Now not all pagans share a view of a dual deity. I myself am what is known as a pantheist/panentheist. It’s actually quite hard to classify myself. Pantheism is the belief that everything holds a spark of the divine. Panentheism is the belief that everything in the universe is contained within “God”, but that “God” is infinitely larger than the universe. I, myself, believe in a single Divine Source/Creator. I hold beliefs that are found in both pantheism and panentheism. There is actually something referred to as the “Diamond Theory”. This theory is that all gods, goddesses, what have you, are aspects of a single Divine Source. Much like a diamond, they are but different facets of that source.
#2- In answer to your second question, no true pagan…one holding true to their beliefs…would want to do anything to you. We are heavy believers in Karma and have a tenet known as the “Threefold Law of Return.” This states that whatever you send out, good or bad, will return to you three times as strong as when you sent it. So following this tenet, if a pagan were trying to do something to harm you, then that negativity would return to them three times as strong. Also, a true pagan would NEVER wish to convert you. We simply don’t do that. We don’t believe in proselytizing. Many of us believe that there is no “one true path” but that all religious paths are valid. So if you’re happy believing that Jesus is your Savior, more power to you. Many of the pagans that might argue with you about Christianity are usually #1- very young and not well studied, or #2- new to Paganism and may be harboring some resentment towards Christianity, such as they may have felt restricted, bullied, or else felt like they have been the subject of religious abuse. As to the bible stating that there is magick and witches…the three wise men who traveled to Bethlehem were astrologers and alchemists…as in they practiced what is commonly referred to among pagans as High Magick. Even Hebrew prophets were commonly known to communicate with “spirits” to gain wisdom. As for the phrase most commonly heard by pagans..”Thou shall not suffer a witch to live.” The word that was translated as “witch” was not “witch” at all, but poisoner. King James was very afraid of anything occult related and had the bible translated to reflect this fear.
#3- Ok, here we’re probably going to have a difference of opinion. And this is just in my point of view, not speaking for all pagans. The bible was written by man. And the latest most popular version was written by men that weren’t even alive during the said time period. Personally, I don’t know of ANY prophecies that have been scientifically proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. Today’s bible is littered with mistranslations and misinterpretations. This has been proven countless times by even Christian religious scholars. Many Pagans tend to be skeptical about the idea that any book can contain absolute religious or spiritual truth. Books are useful in communicating ideas or teaching techniques, but they cannot take the place of experience, and that is where many Pagans place the greatest emphasis. I’m in no means trying to bash Christianity, or any other religion. It is against the tenets of my organization. I’m simply pointing out what many pagans believe in regards to the bible.
& #4- Now to the question that I could probably spend hours upon hours writing out an answer for you…..What drew me to paganism? My parents did not expose me to religion at a young age, so I was basically left to discover it for myself. I did make some forays into churches at various time in my youth, but it never felt like a place for me. Something about it did not sit well with me. I felt out of place. When my parents did finally start showing some religious leanings, I was forced to attend church with them a few times until they realized I was more of an embarrassment to have present as I was usually lost in space somewhere because the minister’s words had no meaning for me. Now, I was not disrespecting him or his convictions, but I did not share similar beliefs. Beliefs that I had personally formulated over the years by watching and listening to various things did not mesh with the Christian theology. It was about the age of 16-17 I discovered the world of the occult. My school library had a book on witchcraft that caught my eye so I borrowed it, and thus began my investigation into the world of Paganism. About a year later, I met my to-be husband, who had indeed been a pagan for, at that time, about 15+ years. He himself had run the gamut of religions, even having been a born again Christian at one point. We were married, and I began my pagan education full time. Paganism was the one faith where my beliefs fit in, regardless of whether or not anyone else shared them. When I found Paganism, I found my place in the scheme of things. It felt right, and it made me happy. No one preaches to me about sin and retribution. I am solely responsible for my own actions and the consequences thereof. I still believe in a “God” which I choose to call the Divine Source, or Universal Deity. I much prefer to believe in a path that tells me if I do good things, good things will happen to me, rather than if I don’t believe in this man and that he died for my sins, then I’m going to burn forever in a hellish fiery torment. I just can’t wrap my beliefs around an idea that such a loving God would allow something like that to happen to his/her/its creations. So I’m a pagan, and I will probably be a pagan until the day I die. All I ask of anyone is that they respect me and my choice. Don’t try to convert me or save me. I don’t need either. I’m doing just fine on my own. I’m happily married, have two wonderful kids, and am co-founder and VP of a successful pagan church. Respect my right to believe how I choose to believe, as I respect everyone else’s right to believe in whatever they choose, so long as they aren’t harming themselves, anyone else, or violating anyone else’s religious or civil rights.
In conclusion, I hope I have answered your questions fully, and that my answers are fairly understandable. Should you have any other questions, please feel free to ask, and I’ll do my best to answer. In the meantime, brightest blessings to you and yours.
Love and Light, Rev. Heidi L. Andrews (aka Rhiannyn Wildseed)
Just thought I'd share and see what everyone else may have to say.
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
Ok folks....here is the next Question and Answer session with our young Christian friend.
(Him) Well that was an interesting answer to what I asked. I went to like 4 or five sites asking roughly the same thing and I got answers back from three of you. Obviously there is a point to me asking all this, and there is. First please know that I cannot convert you to Christianity, only The Holy Spirit of God Almighty can. So I will just let you know about myself and what I do, then I am going to comment to your comments, if I have time. If not then I will comment again as soon as I can. I don't have a cpu so I go to the local library. My name is Michael Stephenson, 20 years old, currently a part time History/Social Studies Double Major with a Religious Studies Minor. I plan to get a Master's in Secondary Education, coach High School Baseball, and go to a Southern Baptist Seminary to one day become Brother Mike and an accreditted missionary. The Lord has told me what it is I must do and I intend to do it, for if I don't then God will deal with me most nastily. I will not deny that if a person does not accept Jesus Christ as Lord of all, then a very not cool fate awaits them in an eternal Hell, and that's putting it mildly. God has gotten mixed reviews about this, but I have learned that doesn't matter, because we can not be victorious against Him. Enough about that side of Him though. Hell is actually an act of love. He will give those who didn't choose Him what they wanted, an eternal life apart from Him. There is a catch though, they will experience God, and then never see Him again and that's where the anguish will come from. I mean not sound condemning, but that is how it is, because God said so. Please do not lash out, though alot of what you said steps on about twenty toes of mine, and I hope you will continue to read on to what I have to say. I need to get another CPU though, so maybe you will hear the rest in a minute maybe tommorrow. ~God Bless, Michael
Ok, got just a bit longer.......
When you said that Jesus said He was a son of God, not the Only One, you were just incorrect, no offense. Even when you go back to the greek, He claims to be the Son of God. He even says it in the often quoted John 3:16. I can't think of one prophet who used "spirits". It says that "The Lord spoke" or "the Word of The Lord came to me".
I can tell you this; I can prove the Bible to be the inspired Word Of God to you.
More questions....
1. What happens to a witch after death? Reincarnation?
2. Maybe I missed it, but I don't think you told me whether or not a Witch or Wiccan could harm a Christian? I know you talked about "The Three-fold Law", but that didn't answer my question. I had one wiccan tell me that since Christianity was younger than witchcraft, that I was more vurnerable than I thought. Comments?
Well that's it for now cuz I gotta go, but more tommorrow. And you were nicer than the girl who thought I was being arrogant.
~God Bless, Michael
(Me) Yes, many pagans do believe in reincarnation. This is not a rule though. However, almost all I know do believe in the eternity of the soul. Many believe that upon their body's death, their spirit returns to the Summerlands to rest and await their next incarnation. This belief is much like the Hindi beliefs. Just like many religions, many Pagans believe in the immortality of the soul. The difference being very few Pagans believe in concepts like heaven, hell, and judgment. To many Pagans, the idea of heaven and hell is too simplistic and categorized. Many Pagans are more comfortable with ideas like karma and reincarnation. Each life is a chance to learn, find joy, and love.
As for #2..actually, I did answer your question. You are just choosing not to accept it as I've answered it. I stated that no true pagan would WANT to hurt a Christian. We have no animosity towards Christianity. Since so many Christians have a preconceived notion that pagans are evil and perform black magick, why would we want to come across as doing something that would potentially validate that idea? It defeats our whole purpose and belief system. Many of us belief in the "No one can harm you without your consent" idea. Our most well known tenet is "DO NO HARM." Now, what a person, just as a person..not a member of a religious path...chooses to do, or try to do, is a different story. But that is not based on their faith. Just some selfish desire.
Christianity IS one of the youngest organized religions to date. It is in fact less than 2000 years old, as it did not organize until well after Jesus' death. Please do not forget, the Old Testament is NOT Christianity, it is Judaism which is Hebrew. Modern Paganism is itself very young as well, but it does utilize ancient practices. Many religions try to use past history to justify their claims or teachings. When Wicca came to light, many tried to validate it by pointing out evidence of ancient Goddess worship. However, it would be impossible to prove that Paganism, Wicca, etc. has existed in an unbroken tradition for several millennia. Modern Paganism tries to revive these ancient traditions of spirituality. It wishes to make them relevant and meaningful in today’s age. Calling Paganism “the old religion,” Pagans are not trying to make it out that their way is the right and true way. They are simply honoring the fact that this modern religion bases itself on some very ancient practices.
As far as communicating with spirits...be they what they may, they are still spirits...I have a little site for you to read http://www.thefamily.org/dossier/statements/communicating.htm
And, please, no offense intended, but you could not prove to me that the bible is the literal inspired word of God. The bible was written by man, and man is fallible. I know you're going to say that "not when they are inspired by God", but even King James re-wrote the bible to suit his own needs and as a way to control the masses. Even the Hebrews, of whom Jesus was born of, still to this day DEBATE the Holy Scriptures...what their translations truly are, what they truly mean...they do not take the bible literally. It is a guideline, not a literal truth. Many Christians only use certain scriptures in the bible and interpret them one way, totally ignoring what came before and after that particular piece, which can totally change the meaning of the scripture.
As I said, I will not be converted. I was given free will by the Divine Creator, whatever it may be. But without condemning you or bashing you, I must say, the words you have choosen and the way you have spoken them display a fundementalism eerily reminiscent of the Muslim terrorists that crashed two planes into the World Trade Centers, the Pentagon, and a small Pennsylvania field all on a beautiful September day. It is this seemingly "I know I'm right and my way is the true way" attitude that makes many a Pagan refuse to have a religious debate with a Christian. Many Pagans are quite willing to sit down and have a casual conversation or debate so long as they aren’t going in feeling like it’s D-Day and they’re the beaches at Normandy. Bottom line…if you want a Pagan to respect your religion, you need to start by respecting theirs.
If people truly lived up to their claims of being true Christians and followed the true teachings of the Rabbi Jesus, then there would probably not be as much animosity among the world religions today. It's sad to see that many other religions like Islam recognize Jesus as a prophet, yet Christianity still does not want to recognize the prophets of those other religions. So many atrocities have been committed in the name of the Christian God that it's not hard to see how many refuse to see him as a God of Love. The best thing Christianity has going for it today is a wonderful man that at least had the courage to stand up and apologize to the world for the atrocities committed in the past under the flag of Christianity.
I am in no way out to change your mind. Indeed, why would I want to? I am responsible for no one by myself and my actions. You have asked questions. I've tried to answer them. Now it's for you to take a look at my answers and decide what you think about them. I hope I have in no way come across as rude or arrogant, simply willing to help shed some light on a subject that you seem to want to understand a little better.
Sincerely; Rev. Heidi L. Andrews (aka Rhiannyn Wildseed)
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
(Him) Well I am going to say "not when they're inspired by God." Except when I say that, I do not mean King James. I hate that translation because of all the errors. The translation I do use is the NIV, but even with that you could say it has been corrupted by man. But the original writers like Paul, Luke, Matthew, Mark, John, all the Old Testament prophets, were inspired by God. Except this is what I think about the translations: God is sovergein(spelling again). He has a plan for each of us. He knew ahead of time about the different translations. It hasn't thrown anything for a loop. After all God is all powerful, all knowing, and all loving. That's not the only way to prove it though, however the simple faith is enough. Carefully examine some of things in the old testament. For instance note that they circumsised a jewish boy on the eighth day after his birth. Science knows that the vitiman K is most prominent in the eighth day, more than any other day of an young mans life, and very useful for healing. All the rules for sanitation. All the rules concerning health. No other culture had what the Jews had at that time.
As far as the Jews not taking the Bible literally, I know of not one group who doesn't take it literally, so it must be a minority, like the sadduccees in Jesus' time, who didn't believe in a resurrection. But what really draws my attention to the Bible being true is three things:
1. The fufilled prophecy and the prophecy that is being fufilled even today in our life.
2. The amount of times it has been tried to be wiped out.
3. The amount of times it has never been(or never will be) proven wrong.
Oh and no offense taken, and I hope you don't take any offense. You are actually quite pleasent to talk to. I am a fundamentalist. I will be honest that I don't agree with homosexuality, abortions, anything occultish. I don't really compare my self to Islam though, lol! When explaining that, I say that I think if Paul was here he would act the same way. I am sometimes way too harsh with people, more so than not with people who are into the Maitreya and all of that. I don't sugar coat things and I am often ridiculed for it. I am not an advocate of social tolernace, especially with abortion. SO yes, I am a fundmentalist.
The Lord does have a plan though, and one day, one day very soon, I believe all of mankind will see The King return. Many things are happening now that are said in the Bible, things that could not have happened in any other generation.
I obviously do not totally understand paganism, neopaganism, or anything of that sort. I have heard of The Covenant Of The Goddess(I have been looking into this stuff.) and I know about Gardenian Wicca. I am not saying you, because you seem rather intelligent, but maybe most Pagans do not understand Christianity the way a Christian does not understand Paganism, eh? What I know now I know from you, but the Lord has told me about it too. I don't think I need to tell you what God's Word says about it. I am going to present you with two senarioes, just curious as to what you will say and no offense is intended.
1. I live my life as a Christian, you as a Wiccan, we die and you were right about Jesus being just a Rabbi. What happens to me and you?
2. I live my life as a Christian, you as a Wiccan, we die and Jesus was who He says He was. What happens to me and you?
Have a good weekend. I won't be on here until Monday.
~God Bless, Michael
(Me)
OH DEAR! I think you have gotten a slightly wrong idea. I am not now, nor have I ever been, Wiccan. Wicca is a religion in and of itself. I am an eclectic Pagan. Just a Pagan. Eclectic meaning that I draw from any and all paths whatever they contain that may appeal to me and help me in my path. I do use elements of Wicca, witchcraft, a little Buddhism, and a whole lot of personal experience.
And yes...the Hebrews do still debate scripture...find an old Rabbi and ask him about it. They have libraries where they keep their books and they get together in groups and discuss the scriptures and basically turn them inside out and upside down. This next bit is going to be a bit long...but it's not mine, so bear with it.
"The scriptures, intended as a manual, are the clearest proof that this manual was modified during the centuries to better fit to the needs of the new generations. The scriptures differs from the other books because, even though the conductor wire is God, the proposed topics in them are changing in deep way. Let's take the Old Testament, this contains, History, songs, prayers, parables, genealogies, codex of conduct, prophecies, poetry and debates. Like every other work when is translated in other languages, has lost something. "We believe in the Bible as far...." this has scandalized many people but we know that even the book of Mormon in English cannot have the same impact that could have if we could read it in its original language, with the full understanding of who wrote it in its time. Also the other great works of other nature suffer when they are translated. Who reads Shakespeare in English and after reads him in German he should admit that it is not the same thing, and if you read Goethe in German and after in English he will see the same problem. For this is very hard to have the scriptures well understood in languages different from the language in which was written, consider that Jesus spoke in Hebrew but the gospels were written in Greek and after translated in every other languages. Do you really think that in this task they didn't lose anything from the initial meaning. I hope so but I am pretty sure that if, by chance we could have the originals in their own language with the perfect understanding of their language it would be more and more easy to perfect understand them. Have you ever see how many debates we have just for the meaning of just one word sometimes? Because how the people interpret that word could give us a different perspective.
Elder John A. Widtsoe gave an interesting point of view:"The message of the scripture is divine; the words in which it is clothed are human. Failure to make this distinction has led to much misunderstanding. Intelligent readers will separate the message of the scriptures from its form of presentation." (the articles of faith in everyday life) We have to consider that the books of the 2 testaments contain specified instructions for that particular time and don't have a great value, just of human experience. That the scriptures are always in expansion it is easily demonstrated from the evolution of them.
To Moses was given the Law and Jesus gave the Gospel. To Abraham was given the circumcision and Christ took off it. The Bible like canon was formed just after several centuries after the death of Christ, but even the old testament, did you know that until 150 a.c. the Hebrew had in their canon just the first five books of the law and the prophets? In fact the other writings were not considered sacred in the same way, in fact Jesus Himself affirmed that "love your fellow man like yourself and love your God with all your heart" were the whole law and the prophets, He didn't mention the historical books. Matthew 22:36-40 This doesn't mean that the historical books and the poetry were not inspired, but just that they were acknowledged from men later, and this it says a lot regarding the human influence on the scriptures. Martin Luther did fight a lot against the epistle of James and against Revelation. The Catholics have the apocrypha in their Bible, no the Protestants, who is right? The scriptures are not a static document produced once and for ever, complete and unalterable, but even the opposite, they were and they are always in expansion, it is the man that doesn't wish more scriptures that he fears about what he doesn't know. What about the Qumran's manuscripts? Not only they have proven that Hebrews kept for sacred many other documents unknown to us, but further these documents are proving that Christianity at the very beginning was a lot more different from what it is considered Christianity today. Hebrew 1:1-2"
"Have you ever see how many debates we have just for the meaning of just one word sometimes? Because how the people interpret that word could give us a different perspective." THIS is why the Hebrews still debate the scriptures. This exactly. Here is a prime example..(and I'm quoting someone else here)"In old translations of the book of Genesis, recognized by all three faiths, the word we normally view as "God" is actually "Elohim," a plural word more accurately translated by some scholars as "creative gods." Gods...with an 's'. And even in the story of Adam and Eve, after they eat the apple, God is reported to have said "Behold, man has become like unto US for he now knows good and evil." (Sorry if that's not perfectly exact, but it's been a long time since I looked it up.) In many, many other parts of the bible, God refers to himself as singular, such as when he is talking to Moses on Mount Sinai. God refers to himself as "I". So who is this US when he is talking about Adam and Eve?
I'm going to try to answer both of your questions in one fell swoop. If when we die and go to the afterlife, heaven, the summerlands....whatever...and Jesus was just a Rabbi...so what? He teachings were still good and valid. Why should that be negated even if he was just a man, an ordinary man? Oh, by the by...you should study the Hebrew Kabbalah. There is a diagram known as the Tree of Life. On this tree is a point called the 'Christ Point'. I would give you more information on this, but I am not so very versed in the Kabbalah. My husband has studied it and could explain it better than I.
If I get to wherever I'm going, and Jesus is who he says he is...again, so what? I still believe he won't be there alone. What of Buddha? What of, oh heck, Gandi? Both great spiritual teachers that did not follow Christianity. Are you going to try to tell me that they are suffering in hell right now because they didn't accept Jesus? Buddha was born almost 600 years before Jesus, so I don't think so. Buddha was a prince that gave up everything to live a life of spirituality. I hardly think he would be languishing in torment.
I think they all will be together, sharing their beliefs, greeting their followers, and generally enjoying their reward for being great loving, caring teachers during the course of their lives. Jesus said "Noone can reach the Father except through me." I believe this was not a statement of "Do as I say." More that it was a statement of "Do as I do." Through Jesus...through his ACTIONS, not his words. He said "love thy neighbor," not "love the neighbor only if they are of the same faith as you." Buddha said "Conquest begets enmity; the conquered live in misery; the peaceful live happily having renounced conquest and defeat." and "As a mother even with own life protects her only child, so should one cultivate immeasurable loving-kindness towards all living beings." (The Metta Sutta) & "He who both day and night takes delight in harmlessness sharing love with all that live, finds enmity with none." (Samyutta Nikaya. I, 208)
Please,no disrespect, but if you are on a mission to try and convert me or change my mind, please, I ask you...use your time in a more productive manner. Instead of preaching to us pagans that we are doomed, volunteer at a homeless shelter, start a food drive, go to a nursing home and spend time with folks who may not have anyone to visit them and let them know they are not forgotten. But please...if you are just try to save me...no offense, believe me...but you are wasting your time. I am happy. My path is right for me. I don't expect you to completely understand or accept this. All I can say is how do you explain color to the blind. If they cannot see to experience it, they will never truly understand.
Sincerely, Rev. Heidi L. Andrews (aka Rhiannyn Wildseed)
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
Just for everyone's information....I blocked Fundie Boy from my weblog. I got tired of being argued with and being snidely told I was going to Hell every other comment, so this dialog ends here.
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
You did a very good job representing Paganism as a whole. I love how you explained that what you believe doesn't apply to every other self proclaimed Pagan out there.
And I just KNEW he was going to call you Wiccan *snickers*. It seems to me that most everybody, even a large scale of Pagans, will generalize Pagans as Wiccans and Wiccans as Pagans.
I think you got a bit defensive in the end though. I could be wrong, but I don't think he was trying to save you. *shrug* Very good answers on your part, and I loved his questions and interest. Keep us updated!
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Ok after extensive reading, your comments here I mean lol, I have come to the conclusion, and this is just my opinion here ok?; that this young fundie, yes I said it lol, has nothing better to do then try to bash folks, though this one did it in a subtile way. He feels threatened I believe and to be honest, there is no reason to argue with those people that are on their path and do not wish to learn or accept others. I think that you did a great job and you provided the facts, now it is up to this fundie to either further his intellect on Pagans and Wiccans or not. All in all Heidi, you did what you could, and you did it wonderfully. And I think that it was a good idea to block this guy, as there will be no end to the conflict otherwise, he wishes to not learn and you are going to talk til your blue in the face, it is his decision to be close minded - guess you always cant help all to try to see or accept.
I think you did a very good job of explaining your thoughts to him as I would have become impatient very early on. I think he probably thought that if he carried on long enough then he would be able to 'save' you
I think if you'd have let him carry on posting it would just keep going round full circle as you are both set in your beliefs.
I think you did a great job handling him, I would of put him on ignore lol after first post. I feel we don't go around preaching to them why don't they just leave us alone. I think it's fear as they have been taught to fear and not learn. I know here there are all kinds of religions knocking even on my door trying to convert me. I just tell them I have my beliefs and they have thiers...
This guy seemed a lot more civil than most Christians that i myself have tried to have conversations with. Both of you represented your arguments well, with one exception: you were patient and he was pushy. I would have gotten sick of that one just about the time you did.
The funny thing is, after I banned him from my weblog and left a clear, bold notice not to contact me anymore, he tried to email me. I mean, how dense can you be?
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
From someone who is sick to death of evangelical/fundamentalist Christians in general, I think you did a great job in answering this youngster. Like Lady Inanna and others here, I'd have lost patience after his first reply.
I was raised Catholic and am quite familiar with the Christian Bible, and I have great respect for the teachings of Jesus as found in the Gospels. However, I cannot help but have great animosity towards those PseudochristianDominionists who think it is their right and duty to rule us all under their own warped version of Christianity -- and which they are quite literal and determined about.
Silverweb
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Noncooperation with evil is as much a responsibility as cooperation with good.
-Ghandi ..... There is no excuse for willful blindness or voluntary ignorance.
-Me
You and me both. And it's funny how they talk about Jesus this and Jesus that...and they ignore the fact that JESUS NEVER wanted his teachings to become a "religion". He was actively trying to bring DOWN the preisthood of the Jewish religion. He didn't like or agree with the elitism.
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
i read this for the first time tonight heidi, and i have to say i was totally impressed by your articulate answers to this persons questions,once again , it`s things like this make me feel proud to be associated with cepf.
Lately, every time I tell Dave something I have done or said to someone (usually along these lines), he tells me that he's "created a monster".
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All opinions stated in my posts are just that...my opinions...and should not be held in any way as the opinions of the CEPF Board of Directors or of anyone other than myself. - Rev. Heidi Andrews VP CEPF
